Charging problem

[kangaspaja]

Hello from Finland.
I have A problem with charging at idle, tried 3 different stator, 2 suzuki's original, one aftermarket. When measuring AC, aftermarket gives 15VAC all three wire, bikes original gives 17VAC, friends loaned original gives almost 20VAC. At 5000rpm originals give over 60VAC, and aftermarket only 45VAC. Measured all three stator and ohms are 0,2-0,46 depends wich stator, but hey are ok all. Measured two different reculator and both are ok. At idle VDC is 13.3-13.5 and 5000rpm 14-14.2. Measured all wires and grounds, everything is ok. When turn light on at idle, drops 13VDC or little under. Battery is new and fully charged. Magneto is in it place and check that its not loose. Magnets seems to be ok, but is it possible that they have become weak? Running out of ideas what to do... Friends bike give 25VAC at idle, it seems that missing that 5-10VAC (depends wich stator is in) it wont charged enough at idle. Its hard to find replacement magneto to test and new is expensive just to buy to test... Anybody somebody ideas...
Scratching head, loosing hairs, Mikko from Finland

[Eric GSX1400K3]

Permanent magnets don't lose their field strength. Could be broken magnets though.

[grog]

Mikko, clip another earth lead on to see if anything changes, battery to motor.All i can suggest.

[grog]

After talking charging reminded me about mine. Have bar mounted meter which lately showing 13.5v.I thought meter was faulty, just a chinese cheapy. Got the Fluke out today, 14.2 at battery,13.5 at power for meter. Resistance somewhere. Ill start by pulling plugs apart, contact cleaner. Thats a job that probably gets neglected.Back when i was working, used to get heaps of cars playing up because of dirty connection.My bike running fine but wont heal itself, only get worse. Will post my findings 🤞🏻

[Hooli]

Permanent magnets don't lose their field strength. Could be broken magnets though.

I might argue with that.

It's becoming a bit of a thing on classic Brit bike forums for those permanent magnets there to be losing magnetism, seemingly only when stored off the bike & no stator left inside them though.

I'm no expert on the physics but several people have found after years on the shelf they don't grip as strong as fresh magnets, but we are talking two or three times older than any 14.

[Eric GSX1400K3]

Depends on the amount of magnetite and / or ferrous material in the mix thats thrn pressed into the shape to make the magnet.  Old school magnets could have loads of waste material to bulk them up. Oxidation of the iron is what turns Fe into FeO4 or iron oxide, I.e. rust, is what kills magnets.  Newer magnets are purer, and less likely to lose their field strength (measured in Gauss).  So definitely older magnets can break down, but I would think the vintage of our 14s are such that thr magnets should be good. Like Grog says, check connections, especially earth's onto the frame.

[Hooli]

Depends on the amount of magnetite and / or ferrous material in the mix thats thrn pressed into the shape to make the magnet.  Old school magnets could have loads of waste material to bulk them up. Oxidation of the iron is what turns Fe into FeO4 or iron oxide, I.e. rust, is what kills magnets.  Newer magnets are purer, and less likely to lose their field strength (measured in Gauss).  So definitely older magnets can break down, but I would think the vintage of our 14s are such that thr magnets should be good. Like Grog says, check connections, especially earth's onto the frame.

Cheers, that makes sense about the magnets.

[kangaspaja]

Hello, tried extra earth from beginning, using fluke and amprobe telaris tester gauge for measuring VAC. The problem is that from stator does not come enough VAC at idle. Measure point first plug from stator. Magnets seems ok, tried with 4mm hexkey and all take grip to the key. Magneto case gets heavy sucked in when putting in place. Has anyone measuret idle VAC. Like earlier wrote, at 5000rpm comes around 75VAC and idle max 19,9VAC. Friends bike give 25VAC at idle. Idle VDC is max 13,5, lights on, drops 13-13,2. Rpm VDC is 14,2, lights on drops 13,9-14. So with rpm its ok, but idle charging is very poor. At idle Innovate LC2 goes nuts because too low voltage 
-Mikko

[Irish in Oz]

They are similar to the voltage figures I get after my repairs on previous post on charging, and I don't have a problem.

[Hooli]

I had similar with a chinese stator & ended up replacing it, but I think you've already tried other stators?

[grog]

Had a look at mine, .6v drop from battery to front of bike. Have plugged/unplugged every connector, checked all i can see. Everything still working fine, no idea why, not going to worry anymore. Cant fix the impossible

[kangaspaja]

I had similar with a chinese stator & ended up replacing it, but I think you've already tried other stators?

Hi, tried aftermarket stator and two Suzuki originals, one aftermarket regulator, then mosfet regulator and originals. Best combo so far is friends original stator and aftermarket regulator to get VDC at rpm ok. Found one instruction from finnish website where they talk that motorcycle (no matter brand) at idle VAC should be 20=30 and rpm over 60. Thats why im obsessed that idle VAC should be around 25 so regulator could change it around 14-14.2 VDC. Last summer bike was charging 14VDC lights on at idle like allways, one point at end of summer notice that it was 13VDC at idle lights on. I have microsquirt operating bike and cellphone on steering bars where have data running Temperature, volts, boost, co2, thottleposition etc so there fore notice easy charging problem and assume bad regulator but was wrong. Maybe just have to ride it as Long as it runs and see what happens...

[grog]

Mikko, youve tried your best👍As you said, just ride it.Most 14 riders wouldnt even know their charge voltage.

[Dwain Dibley]

I wire my bikes voltmeters straight across the battery, I see 14+V when riding. Someone on the cx500 forum explained that you will lose 0.something V for every connection between the battery and where you are connected. One guy had clagged into the brake light switch +ve and lost a whole volt, but he knew that and was quite happy to do the sums as he rode.
OK, the meter is always powered on and using power, but I keep all my bikes on maintenance charge when not in use, and can spot a bad battery at ten paces.

My three in various stages of maintenance charge.

D.D.

[grog]

D.D. Hope you fuse it somewhere near battery. Ive seen results of similar non fused, on a car, wire rubbed through on firewall. Not pretty. Just my thoughts Mate. 👍