Hi
What fuel is everyone using and do you see a difference in performance with different brands?
I always use E5 premium petrol but use a few different petrol stations, the tank before last was Shell E5 V Power & the bike ran great on it, as I was running low on fuel last night with the one bar left and petrol pump light flashing I pulled in to my local Tesco and filled up there with E5 premium. I only had a short ride home after filling up but could almost instantly feel the difference, the bike didn't feel as responsive and showed signs of hesitation
Is supermarket fuel really that bad?
As there are only a few refineries in the UK all petrol comes from the same place so I don't believe there is much difference in them, using a supermarket will ensure the fuel you buy is always fresh, some out of the way fuel stations could have quite old fuel in their tanks. I think it's all about the additives in the fuel that make the difference. I use E10 and my bike runs fine but then again I am a cheapskate. :whistling:
Esso supreme 99(E5) is my preferred choice,BP then Shell. I have run on E10 out of necessity once and she didn't like it one bit.
Std 95ron when I'm feeling generous, otherwise it's 91ron for her, no ethanol at all.
I always try to use the same station on the way home to fill up, as it's near my house, I use E5 (Jet). I also whack in Redex when I get home, at 2.5 ml per litre.
I do this with all my bikes and they seem to thrive on it.
D.D.
I always use E5, all my bikes feel flat, rough & unresponsive on E10. Plus they get that much worse MPG it's actually cheaper using the more expensive undiluted fuel.
When I was abroad last year I found 100 octane for sale in Germany & further east, the HD went like bloody stink on it & got a massive MPG improvement, so shame it's never seen over here.
I've always used Tesco 99 on the bike and my mk2 Focus st (xr5), if its good for the focus then its good for bike. :notworthy:
So long as its E5 from Shell, Esso, BP or Tesco, I'll run my GS on it.
As the GSX 1.4 is a very basic EFI system and unless you have modified the engine/ timing ,except for the additives(if any)anything above 91 is effectively wasted money.
But if you think your bike runs better on your preferred fuel most of us live in semi free countrys,Enjoy!!!
91 with occasional 98 to keep tank clean, has cleaning additives. Runs exact same on all of them.
E5 from Texaco for me - never any super market fuel :)
Quote from: Horse on Sunday, 07 July 2024, 12:54 PMAs the GSX 1.4 is a very basic EFI system and unless you have modified the engine/ timing ,except for the additives(if any)anything above 91 is effectively wasted money.
But if you think your bike runs better on your preferred fuel most of us live in semi free countrys,Enjoy!!!
It's not the octane that makes the difference, it's the ethanol. Ethanol burns much slower so changes the flamefront propagation within the cylinder, which requires a different ignition map & fuelling to run right. If they sold 95 RON with no ethanol I'd run on that as it'd be fine for a 14.
95 RON without ethanol for me as well. As that is not available, I have been running 98 RON without ethanol for years. Not available anymore, so filling her with precious ethanol-free 102 RON.
Main reason for ethanol-free are the rust promoting properties of ethanol.
Second reason: Engine is set up for non-ethanol.
Third reason: ethanol has less energy (
Quote from: Hooli on Sunday, 07 July 2024, 09:06 PMEthanol burns much slower so changes the flamefront propagation
), so you have to burn more ie lower MPG.
With the 102 RON I probably fiddle a bit more with the ignition timing.
Quote from: Hooli on Sunday, 07 July 2024, 09:06 PMQuote from: Horse on Sunday, 07 July 2024, 12:54 PMAs the GSX 1.4 is a very basic EFI system and unless you have modified the engine/ timing ,except for the additives(if any)anything above 91 is effectively wasted money.
But if you think your bike runs better on your preferred fuel most of us live in semi free countrys,Enjoy!!!
It's not the octane that makes the difference, it's the ethanol. Ethanol burns much slower so changes the flamefront propagation within the cylinder, which requires a different ignition map & fuelling to run right. If they sold 95 RON with no ethanol I'd run on that as it'd be fine for a 14.
It is irrelevant what you slow the burn down with in the the old days it was tetra ethyl lead now it benzine tolulene or xylene we don't generally use Ethanol in OZ not on my side of OZ anyway ,unless as you say you alter the timing you will get no benefit out of the more expensive fuel the octane number is indicative of the fuels resistance to detonation the higher the number the greater the resistance and the slower the burn.
Quote from: Horse on Sunday, 07 July 2024, 10:28 PMQuote from: Hooli on Sunday, 07 July 2024, 09:06 PMQuote from: Horse on Sunday, 07 July 2024, 12:54 PMAs the GSX 1.4 is a very basic EFI system and unless you have modified the engine/ timing ,except for the additives(if any)anything above 91 is effectively wasted money.
But if you think your bike runs better on your preferred fuel most of us live in semi free countrys,Enjoy!!!
It's not the octane that makes the difference, it's the ethanol. Ethanol burns much slower so changes the flamefront propagation within the cylinder, which requires a different ignition map & fuelling to run right. If they sold 95 RON with no ethanol I'd run on that as it'd be fine for a 14.
It is irrelevant what you slow the burn down with in the the old days it was tetra ethyl lead now it benzine tolulene or xylene we don't generally use Ethanol in OZ not on my side of OZ anyway ,unless as you say you alter the timing you will get no benefit out of the more expensive fuel the octane number is indicative of the fuels resistance to detonation the higher the number the greater the resistance and the slower the burn.
Yes I'm aware the octane reflects that. Octane is more about denotion resistance than burn speed though, as I understand it the lower octane petrols burn at the same speed as the higher ones, it's just they detonate with less provocation. Ethanol burns slower than real petrol so needs spark advancement & a richer mixture to get the best out of it.
As you don't have ethanol on your fuel you won't have felt it for yourself. But the bikes really do run noticeably rough and down on power as soon as I use it. Within a couple of hundred yards of filling up with E10 they feel broken until I put proper petrol in again. Plus my 14 gives about 25miles less per tank on E10, proving it's running badly on the stuff, the other bikes are the same in how it affects them.
Quote from: Hooli on Monday, 08 July 2024, 01:28 AMQuote from: Horse on Sunday, 07 July 2024, 10:28 PMQuote from: Hooli on Sunday, 07 July 2024, 09:06 PMQuote from: Horse on Sunday, 07 July 2024, 12:54 PMAs the GSX 1.4 is a very basic EFI system and unless you have modified the engine/ timing ,except for the additives(if any)anything above 91 is effectively wasted money.
But if you think your bike runs better on your preferred fuel most of us live in semi free countrys,Enjoy!!!
It's not the octane that makes the difference, it's the ethanol. Ethanol burns much slower so changes the flamefront propagation within the cylinder, which requires a different ignition map & fuelling to run right. If they sold 95 RON with no ethanol I'd run on that as it'd be fine for a 14.
It is irrelevant what you slow the burn down with in the the old days it was tetra ethyl lead now it benzine tolulene or xylene we don't generally use Ethanol in OZ not on my side of OZ anyway ,unless as you say you alter the timing you will get no benefit out of the more expensive fuel the octane number is indicative of the fuels resistance to detonation the higher the number the greater the resistance and the slower the burn.
Yes I'm aware the octane reflects that. Octane is more about denotion resistance than burn speed though, as I understand it the lower octane petrols burn at the same speed as the higher ones, it's just they detonate with less provocation. Ethanol burns slower than real petrol so needs spark advancement & a richer mixture to get the best out of it.
As you don't have ethanol on your fuel you won't have felt it for yourself. But the bikes really do run noticeably rough and down on power as soon as I use it. Within a couple of hundred yards of filling up with E10 they feel broken until I put proper petrol in again. Plus my 14 gives about 25miles less per tank on E10, proving it's running badly on the stuff, the other bikes are the same in how it affects them.
Agreed, burn speed is a poor choice of words with straight petrol ,the resistance to detonation offers more timing advance with longer effective piston pressures giving increased power, from the little I know of ethanol I am glad I won't have to use it but it makes perfect sense that you lose mileage with it unless the engine management can compensate.
Glad I was making sense at least, I'm deffo not an expert in it. Just read up a bit after getting running issues on some engines when it came in.
Oh goody this shit-show again :whistling:
As per the manual - our bikes are designed to run on 91RON, and this was in the era prior to the widespread adoption of ethanol fuels.
So 95, 98 whatever offer no advantage, but do come at a significantly higher cost.
I always run mine on 91 and only ever 95 or 98 when I'm somewhere and 91 is unavailable (extremely rare I think its happened twice in 10+ years)
Aside, that is, from some testing I did which indicated.
There was fuck all difference between fuels as far as fuel consumption is concerned. Any slight benefits were almost certainly statistical anomalies and certainly didn't come close to making up the cost difference.
This held true for both configurations of my bike.
1. Akro full exhaust with PC3
2. As above plus Yoshi Stage 1 cams.
So here's my hot take.
1. 91RON. This also allows you to buy more fuel for your $ to go on more rides.
2. or do whatever you want that makes you feel good. Your bike, your money. :onya:
Thank you Vlad for your contribution to the shit-show. :whistling:
91RON hasn't been available here for many years. 95 is the lowest.
As long as it is ethanol-free, I take it.
I tested E5 vs E10 in my old car extensively. Subjective performance was no different, but E10 MPG ate up the difference in price.
E5 rust-promoting properties vs ethanol-free were clearly visible on my steel tank.
My secret fuel sponsor (yes - I really have a fuel sponsor :P) has no problem with me filling up with premium fuel. The only conditition of the sponsor is to never fill with E10. :happy1:
💩🙀 f..k me a bigger can of worms I can't think of 🥸
I've only run 95ron in my GSX.
My 2015 BMW R1200RT likes 98ron.
My Mazda 3 runs 91ron.
I've never used petrol with ethanol, I'm not convinced it's of any benefit to anyone.
So many diff petrol types all over the world. I dont see a populated problem with our bikes from any particular fuel used.
Quote from: GSXKING on Monday, 08 July 2024, 06:36 PM💩🙀 f..k me a bigger can of worms I can't think of 🥸
I've only run 95ron in my GSX.
My 2015 BMW R1200RT likes 98ron.
My Mazda 3 runs 91ron.
I've never used petrol with ethanol, I'm not convinced it's of any benefit to anyone.
We don't have a choice anymore, all petrol in the UK is contaminated with ethanol.
Quote from: Mick_J on Monday, 08 July 2024, 06:58 PMWe don't have a choice anymore, all petrol in the UK is contaminated with ethanol.
It doesn't stop there. Many drinks are contaminated with it. :cheers:
Shell V power or Neste 98 E5. Always high octane.
Unfortunately we can't buy petrol without ethanol.
Russian Lukoil Ekto Sport 100 was the best and without ethanol,
but for some reasons we can't buy anymore. It has never been for sale in Finland,
but I live so near Russian border....
Were very lucky i guess.91, 95, 98 dont have ethanol. Ive seen a fuel rail on a car where he just used E10, it was internally so rusty it blocked up, wish i had a pic to show.Know idea why but my cars n bike all seem to run better on BP petrol, imagination?? My garden tools all get 98, seem to start better. That could also be imagination but thats my way of choice.
Agree re BP. I was getting better mileage, no dpf and egr issues using BP premium diesel in my 4x4 than all the others.
It's a quality fuel, but always 30-40cpl dearer than the others
Thats good Eric, no DPF issues. My 2016 Hilux, 5 DPF replaced in 200th ks. All under wrty but 14g each. Have had Isuzu now 30 th ks, no issues, not even one burn off, Hilux used to do at least 4 per week.Over 200k per tank same amount from Isuzu. Totally hate driving assists, specially the auto braking, so bloody scary, terrible technology.So glad my bike doesnt have that auto crap.
Quote from: GSXKING on Monday, 08 July 2024, 06:36 PM💩🙀 f..k me a bigger can of worms I can't think of 🥸
Ok then what oil should I use, what tyres and what chain lube? :lol:
Chain Lube? aren't chains sealed for life with those X ring things? Ya just have to wash 'em down now & again. :whistling:
Where is the chain part located Col? :laugh:
Quote from: grog on Wednesday, 10 July 2024, 06:34 PMWhere is the chain part located Col? :laugh:
Between cyl 2 & 3 I reckon . . .
Quote from: KiwiCol on Wednesday, 10 July 2024, 08:14 PMQuote from: grog on Wednesday, 10 July 2024, 06:34 PMWhere is the chain part located Col? :laugh:
Between cyl 2 & 3 I reckon . . .
Oh that could cause some tension.
I'm cognisant of a strong link in this chain of events potentially transmitting some rather loose information.