Just been out to check over things before a 3 day ride. While checking & lubing the chain, I noticed about 6 (that's ½ a dozen for the poms) of the black x rings were missing from the links & one was falling out as I was going round the chain.
Now, this chain is still fairly new, done about 15 thou k's. Always cleaned (with Kero) & lubed regular.
Anyone else had this? Does it mean this chain is stuffed? I don't have time to replace it before heading away, so I've lubed it up, still sounds quiet & no sticking links. (not to say there won't be after the run)
It's an RK 530 GB530XS0Z1 says high performance & general street use.
So, if this is buggered, what's the word on chains? DID? RK?
I see DID do one called 530 ZVM-X expensive, says for heavy weight bikes, high torque & horse power. In NZ cost $380 + shipping on E-Bay it's $297 landed
Do we need something this heavy duty for our marque? Or do these just last longer being a heavy weight thing.
BTW, what do you reckon about 15,000k on a chain? Fair or have I had a dud?
Personally I'd say 15,000 Kms on a chain is poor given you've maintained it, actually very poor. And the x-rings should not be falling out. For a properly maintained chain, I'd expect about 18,000 miles as an absolute minimum (which is what about 28,800 Km? And that's minimum). Why the seals are falling out though is anyone's guess - faulty chain? Seals reacted to the kerosene? Who knows. But the seals should not have come out.
Makes me also wonder what your sprockets are like especially the gearbox sprocket. Did you replace the sprockets when you replaced the chain(that could have been a cause for rapid wear if not possibly). But I'd check the gearbox sprocket at least before leaving.
Personally I've always been a DID chain man myself, have used the DID Gold X-Ring Drive Chain (530VXGB x 116 Link) as a replacement for a couple of mates with no worries (and had I had to replace mine would have used same). I appreciate there are other makes like AFAM and Ognibene around, possibly some equivalents down under. The price you quote just for a chain landed though sounds quite expensive.
Anyway - to me your chain sounds like it's on the way out, the x-rings should not come out, they are supposed to keep dirt out from inside the links, so I'd certainly take a can of spray grease with you on your trip to keep it alll lubed up. If it's all running ok, then keep a watch on it, but I'd start saving for a new chain an sprockets as with the seals missing, wear will be more rapid in those links than others I think.
Thx Dave, I did the 2 sprockets when I put the new chain on. They (the rear anyway) looks brand new, no hooking & teeth nice & square across tips.
Just checked the front, it's fine like the back.
I think you got sold a dud chain buddy, if everything is good with the sprockets etc, then the chain hasn't worn in that respect, but with the x-rings missing, you stand a greater chance of getting dirt in between the links.
I'd contact the chain manufacturer, maybe mail them with pictures and ask their opinion - and what they can suggest to compensate you maybe, as no way should your chain have lost those seals at this mileage, even if you 100% neglected it.
Whilst I was out checking the front sprocket, I dismantled a spare couple of links off this chain (came as 118, need 116) to see what the o rings are like on something that has never been on a bike & the ones that came off. Both fairly similar as far as texture & 'rubberyness' goes. (they feel the same)
The new ones had white grease (as they do) on them & the ones off the bike were just straight black. It was broken & also sheared on 1 spot (a piece has broken off the profile of it - if you know what I mean)
Just wonder if it was the Wurth chain lube I used originally on this chain? Although, all the links had this applied, not just the 6 that have gone. Just wonder. Maybe they'll all go.
I can't see that Col personally, I think its a duff set of rubber seals they have used, which have deteriorated rather quickly. Maybe the kero you use to clean the chain has affected them, but if the ones off the 2 spare links are the same as the ones on the chain - still rubbery - I can't see that.
The only other thing - obscure as it may be - I can think of is that the rear wheel is not aligned right so the sprockets have been pulling the chain to one side slightly. But in the mileage you've done, I think you'd have noticed your rear wheel being out of alignment.
One thing though I might do before you do - just pull the rear wheel out and check your sprocket carrier bearing. If there is movement in the rear sprocket this could have affected the chain and possibly buggered the seals. Who knows. But if you are off on a 3 day trip, worthwhile checking!
I use DID X-Ring chains on mine. Usually reckon to get around 18,000 miles out of one. They come with a 15k/2 year warranty.
As the chain wears/stretches you'll find you're having to adjust it more frequently..Once I get to the stage where I'm adjusting every week to ten days then it's time to change it along with the sprockets.
I did notice when I rebuilt my bike earlier this year that one of the X rings was hanging out of the link.Chain has only been on for 7000 miles. I've never had this happen before.
I checked the rest of the chain and all the other X rings were in place. It's refitted now and I'll just keep an eye on it for the next few months and see if any more X rings fail.
I've got her booked in to get new tyres fitted next Wednesday (after the run), I'll have them run their eye over things whilst they're in there. I'm sure if it's out of alignment or the bearing is naf, they'll be quick to let me know.
It's going in to the Yamaha shop, Suzuki couldn't / wouldn't match the price for Angels & Suzuki are a dealer for them here. I even asked them specifically & said I could get a better deal from Trevor Pierce, they said they couldn't do it for that. Too bad, I walked.
Just checked the maint log, this chain has only done 10,000k (6,000 miles)!! FFS!!!
Then there is something wrong in its manufacture, no way do chains wear out that quick
Quote from: gsxbarmy on Friday, 03 March 2017, 07:04 PM
Then there is something wrong in its manufacture, no way do chains wear out that quick
I agree.
The chain itself wont be worn/stretched in only 6000 miles. I'd guess that during manufacture the side plates were probably pressed on too much and because it's a little tight, it's causing the X rings to be broken and forced out.
Did you fit it Col, or did a shop fit it - if a shop, I'd be having a few words right now mate.
If you fitted the chain yourself get on to the manufacturers, if a dealer fitted it get back to them, even a shit chain should last 6000 miles.
i think its stuffed Col. i was a wurth fanatic, my rk seized up two links. cut it up after removal, full of rust and just not a pretty sight. not sure if wurth is any good now. i wont try it again. i actually thought my gearbox was rooted, so noisy. my sprockets still all good but very old. no sign of wear. thinking my sprockets will need changing soon, i just fitted o ring from ek. very cheap. my thoughts were ill do full kit within 10 th. ks. chain has been brilliant, 10 th ks later everything still looks and sounds same. will fit new sprockets and chain when needed. my chain will be ek, zzz. sprockets maybe jt, get good write up. original suzuki fr. is $150, jt is 35. i really think oil is the secret. manual says use oil. scottoiler is sworn by so many to be the best way. i agree. one day ill get one. until then im using vmx castrol gear oil, no smell. pour it on either side, oil can, spin wheel a lot of times. wipe off. do a little ride, then wipe off again. will make a bit of a mess on bike, just clean her up. good for at least a thou ks.
I fitted it. Rivet link. It's not just that link though, 1 of the link ones has gone, but 5 others have too.
Think I'll just order another $300 chain & be done with it. Get that DID one - the heavy duty job. Don't like things that are suspect - rather know it's all good. And do it before it stuffs the sprockets too.
They're JT sprockets BTW, came as a set. OK aren't they?
JT sprockets are okay, they use a high grade steel. I would still contact the chain manufacturer though.
Did a bit of looking at google on this specific chain, says for 750 - 1000cc. Why?? Not the CC, it's the power the machine makes surely! You can get 750 - 1000cc machines putting out 160 - 200hp!
Reckon Mr RK Chain maker would say you'rs is a 1400, chain not for that bike. Like insurance co's. But it's a 530 pitch, big heavy chain.
This is the kit I use..A lot cheaper in the UK than in NZ Col
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/172324902718?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
Thx Froudy, that is a bloody good price for chain & sprockets, way better that what I've been looking at.
Just seen a chain & it cost (inc shipping of & $162!!) $484
http://www.ebay.com/itm/EK-3D-Z-Premium-Gold-530-150-Link-Chain-4-Extended-Hayabusa-ZX-14-GSXR-ETC-/361426914469 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/EK-3D-Z-Premium-Gold-530-150-Link-Chain-4-Extended-Hayabusa-ZX-14-GSXR-ETC-/361426914469)
Going by their speil, these are the dogs! They'd wanna be at that price.
Try contacting Julian at Just Bandits to see if he can help out Col, he's shipped a load of stuff down under before (he's a member on here now as well)
that is a great price Froudy. 200 oz dollars. have swayed me from ek. ek is at least another 150. have bookmarked. well done.
Something else worth checking is the width of the inner links, with a vernier, if they're a bit wider on the ones with failed O rings it's a faulty chain. I had something similar on a DID VX530 chain, on which the joint link O ring squidged out within 200 miles - I renewed the link 4 times, with new links, assuming it was down to my duff riveting, before measuring the inner link width, and finding it to be 0.25mm oversize. I got a no quibble replacement from the supplier, and it's been fine since.
Thx Dusty, I'll have a check of this.
Update to this chain, (I fitted a new chain yesterday DID VZM-X 530)
I paid particular attention to the riveting on this one, plates are the same distance as manufactures (22mm), flare is 5.6 - 5.7mm on rivet link, manufactures are 5.7mm. Heaps of grease in & all around the new link.
Anyway, the reason for the post, Dave mentioned about alignment possibly out on the old chain. I went to some lengths to check, using different methods too. Turns out my marks are almost exactly the same both sides, about ½ the thickness of the 'notch hole' different. That's about .5 - 1mm variance.
(Alignment was fine BTW)
Dave's method of measuring from the back of the adjuster block to the front of the swing arm where the tensioner bolt goes in (great way of checking too Dave, Thx!) gave me a measurement of 82mm on the old chain.
New chain goes on - I'd wound the adjusters way in, getting the sag right, guess what, the same measurement on the new chain was 81.5mm.
That means the 'old' chain was hardly worn at all & just the x rings breaking. What a waste of money that RK chain was. The chain itself was ok, just the rings!
The chain is still relatively stiff (like new ones are) I ground off the rivet link pin & broke it there, I have a new RK530 rivet link which I could use to re-join it. Just these x rings. Hmmm
Another x ring fell out when I broke the chain - as it would & I checked how it felt, it was more of a plastic feel than a rubbery seal, more hard & brittle, like it would snap if I bent it. Went back to the bench & compared with the rest from the chain - they're the same. Must have been a bad batch of x rings or the chain has got hot and cooked the x rings maybe?? I'm thinking the Wurth dry spray again? That's what this chain had from new till I went to a more 'normal' chain lube from a spray can.
It's interesting to note that on the back of the DID pack it says to lube the chain every 500k with 80-90 oil, & shows where to put the oil. Just oil, not the sticky chain lube ya get in a can.
Grog was correct, he tried all sorts of lube & reckons that just oil was the best - and so do DID.
I've got a few cans of Wurth in the cave & a couple of cans of spray chain lube too, I've also got some diff oil, 80-90 that's surplus to requirements - guess what one I'm going to use on this new (expensive) chain?
Thx Dave & Grog, I appreciate your assistance every time. Cheers guys. :cheers:
Thx Col, good write-up that :onya:
Thanks from me also Col. i think the RK i had was also faulty. It shouldnt have seized up links. Youll smell the gear oil, a smell i dislike from fixing diffs and gearboxes. Get some vmx castrol. Youll find new chain just so nice with oil on it.