Can anybody tell me where I could buy a good front fork cartridge holding tool for K6?
Here's a link on how to create your own . . .
https://gsx1400owners.org/forum/index.php?topic=378.0
Search on here is your friend .
And if you can't find just ask as so much in-depth knowledge here .
Good luck :cheers:
I am well aware of all instructions on these pages on how to make the tool but I try to avoid making one.
I have searched the Internet to find the part number and/or a supplier for the correct tool but only found information on the K2-K4 tool, part no. 09940-30250. Even the Haynes service manual suggests using that tool but in their photos they have a K5+ cartridge.
I would appreciate it if somebody could help me to find the K5+ tool.
In all the 20 years I've never seen one for sale for either the original or later type of fork internal .
Maybe I should start making and selling them :cheers:
Quote from: Tim1954 on Tuesday, 07 December 2021, 06:20 PM
I am well aware of all instructions on these pages on how to make the tool but I try to avoid making one.
I have searched the Internet to find the part number and/or a supplier for the correct tool but only found information on the K2-K4 tool, part no. 09940-30250. Even the Haynes service manual suggests using that tool but in their photos they have a K5+ cartridge.
I would appreciate it if somebody could help me to find the K5+ tool.
Suzuki - for whatever reason - never made one. Same as
@seth above, I too searched for one for ages, including speaking with the chief mechanics of a couple of large Suzuki dealerships and the tool plain doesn't exist. Th eonly option is to make your own. Sorry
In the Internet there are some dealers who advertise that they can supply the Suzuki OEM tool, part no. 09940-30250. See for example partzilla.com
https://www.partzilla.com/product/suzuki/09940-30250
Unfortunately there are no good enough pictures of the tool.
Anyway, I managed to uninstall one cartridge without the holding tool and noticed that there are four little holes in the head, 17,5 mm apart, 25 mm diagonally. I made a tubular tool with four pins matching the holes and by using this tool I managed to uninstall the other cartridge.
I assume that the Suzuki tool might be similar to the one I made and that's why it is suitable for all 14's.
Pictures:
(https://gsx1400owners.org/forum/gallery/0/3374-081221015343.jpeg)
(https://gsx1400owners.org/forum/gallery/0/3374-081221023834.jpeg)
The tube I used is a bit too large, that's why I had to bend the pins inwards. Before installing the cartridges back to the forks I will make a better tool using a smaller tube.
as others have said never seen one advertised I asked on here and got the dimensions and made my own
happy to get dimensions if anyone wants them
K4 and earlier one
Quote from: Tim1954 on Wednesday, 08 December 2021, 02:01 AM
In the Internet there are some dealers who advertise that they can supply the Suzuki OEM tool, part no. 09940-30250. See for example partzilla.com
https://www.partzilla.com/product/suzuki/09940-30250
Unfortunately there are no good enough pictures of the tool.
Anyway, I managed to uninstall one cartridge without the holding tool and noticed that there are four little holes in the head, 17,5 mm apart, 25 mm diagonally. I made a tubular tool with four pins matching the holes and by using this tool I managed to uninstall the other cartridge.
I assume that the Suzuki tool might be similar to the one I made and that's why it is suitable for all 14's.
Yes there are plenty of places that advertise it Tim - sadly it's one of those where Suzuki omitted to change the part number when they made the later forks, so what you get (if you order that part number) is the tool for the earlier forks.
Race Tech sell them. Our forks are Showa?
Race Tech tool fits only K2-K4 and is different from the OEM tool, as are all tubular self made tools on these pages. The OEM tool has only two smaller pins according to a picture in the service manual.
There is one on the following page that might fit the K5+ if the dimensions are correct to fit the holes in the cartridge head:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/SUZUKI-OEM-FRONT-FORK-ASSEMBLING-TOOL-09940-31710-/154187399685
The part no. of that tool is 09940-31710 and it is sold by several dealers, including Megazip. Being their registered customer I can ask them whether the tool fits K5+ and if not, do they have a better one.
Well, my search for the correct tool is over now. The one I made is almost perfect. Using a bit smaller tube I will make an even better tool.
Quote from: Tim1954 on Wednesday, 08 December 2021, 02:01 AM
Anyway, I managed to uninstall one cartridge without the holding tool and noticed that there are four little holes in the head, 17,5 mm apart, 25 mm diagonally. I made a tubular tool with four pins matching the holes and by using this tool I managed to uninstall the other cartridge.
Tim, are your measurements of the cartridge's holes center to center, or between inner (or outer) borders? Also, what's the size of the holes (or the pins :-) )
Thanks !
Quote from: SpongeBob on Wednesday, 08 December 2021, 10:26 PM
Quote from: Tim1954 on Wednesday, 08 December 2021, 02:01 AM
Anyway, I managed to uninstall one cartridge without the holding tool and noticed that there are four little holes in the head, 17,5 mm apart, 25 mm diagonally. I made a tubular tool with four pins matching the holes and by using this tool I managed to uninstall the other cartridge.
Tim, are your measurements of the cartridge's holes center to center, or between inner (or outer) borders? Also, what's the size of the holes (or the pins :-) )
Thanks !
https://gsx1400owners.org/forum/index.php?topic=378.0
Quote from: gsxbarmy on Wednesday, 08 December 2021, 11:56 PM
Quote from: SpongeBob on Wednesday, 08 December 2021, 10:26 PM
Quote from: Tim1954 on Wednesday, 08 December 2021, 02:01 AM
Anyway, I managed to uninstall one cartridge without the holding tool and noticed that there are four little holes in the head, 17,5 mm apart, 25 mm diagonally. I made a tubular tool with four pins matching the holes and by using this tool I managed to uninstall the other cartridge.
Tim, are your measurements of the cartridge's holes center to center, or between inner (or outer) borders? Also, what's the size of the holes (or the pins :-) )
Thanks !
https://gsx1400owners.org/forum/index.php?topic=378.0
Thanks Barmy :-) the tools described in topic 378, and measurements pictured by Seth, show dimensions for a tool that holds the (K5+) on the flat parts of it's collar outer edge -- which is fine -- but I was interested by the inner 4 holes that Tim has made a tool for and the Suzuki tool seems also to be made for... ;-)
@SpongeBob the measurements are from center to center. The hole diameter is 2,5 mm but better make the pins smaller, mine are 2 mm. If you are unistalling the cartridge loosen the bolt first from the bottom of the fork outer tube (it is probably VERY tight) and only after that start holding the cartridge in place.
As mentioned before I have not yet tried the tool when installing the cartridge and it is interesting to see whether it is strong enough to allow tightening to 40 Nm. If not the only option is to make the other type of tool.
@Tim1954 Thanks for confirming these numbers.
I actually currently have a K2 with "Gen1" forks and associated internals -- and made the ad-hoc tools for maintenance as many others.
I was interested by the K5+ style tools in anticipation, just in case at some point I come across those "Gen2" forks, either to help a friend, or for when I'll get/prepare spare forks as a possible replacement -- as at 120.000Kms I expect that sooner or later cartridges of my current forks would fail. At that point I would probably not have much of a choice on what I can find on the used parts market...
So I was just curious about the different tools options...
I would also be curious to see if the pins with withstand 40Nm torque :-)
I wouldn't worry about the cartridges failing, Over 163k miles on my K2 & the forks work as well as ever.
It's had seals, stanctions, bushes & lots of oil, but that's just service items.
Quote from: Hooli on Thursday, 09 December 2021, 06:47 PM
It's had seals, stanctions, bushes & lots of oil, but that's just service items.
All the same here, as you can guess :-)
I made a new tool using 3/4 inch water pipe (OD 26,9 mm) and tried to tighten the bolt to 40 Nm. Tool did not withstand the torque!
Having seen a lot of discussion about cartridge tools and whether they are needed or not (many people say that they are not needed at all) I tried to put the fork together (without oil) and adjust the spring preload to maximum and then tighten to 40 Nm with the spring holding the cartridge. No success, the cartridge did spin inside the fork.
However, I made a simple tool which can be used for holding the cartridge in place when less torque is needed.
(https://gsx1400owners.org/forum/gallery/0/3374-131221222232.jpeg)
My next task is to make the other type of tool. I just would like to avoid welding and so I'll try to find some other way of constructing it.
Maybe the later models are different, I rebuilt the front end of my K3 without the cartridge tool and was able to correctly torque the lower bolt. No issues since.
Best of luck with making your own tool, I'd suggest some round bar with slotted ends, maybe drill or machine out the last part to get it to fit.
@Eric GSX1400K3 The early and later fork internals are totally different.
Tools required to strip and rebuild are also different
Quote from: gsxbarmy on Wednesday, 08 December 2021, 12:22 AM
Suzuki - for whatever reason - never made one. Same as @seth above, I too searched for one for ages, including speaking with the chief mechanics of a couple of large Suzuki dealerships and the tool plain doesn't exist. Th eonly option is to make your own. Sorry
@gsxbarmy When you talked to the Suzuki mechanics, what did they say about tightening the bolts, if a tool is not available? Do they make the holding tools or do they just tighten against the spring until the cartridge spins? Do they use impact driver? I guess there must exist some instructions from the manufacturer.
Quote from: Tim1954 on Tuesday, 14 December 2021, 06:28 AM
Quote from: gsxbarmy on Wednesday, 08 December 2021, 12:22 AM
Suzuki - for whatever reason - never made one. Same as @seth above, I too searched for one for ages, including speaking with the chief mechanics of a couple of large Suzuki dealerships and the tool plain doesn't exist. Th eonly option is to make your own. Sorry
@gsxbarmy When you talked to the Suzuki mechanics, what did they say about tightening the bolts, if a tool is not available? Do they make the holding tools or do they just tighten against the spring until the cartridge spins? Do they use impact driver? I guess there must exist some instructions from the manufacturer.
I never discussed that with them unfortunately, I only discussed the tool part number - which turned out to be the tool for the earlier forks. In the end I made my own to do my forks.
I ended up welding the tool using a 32 mm tube:
(https://gsx1400owners.org/forum/gallery/0/3374-151221183503.jpeg)
(https://gsx1400owners.org/forum/gallery/0/3374-151221183551.jpeg)
I'm still waiting for the seals and dust covers to be available in the local spares shop and when fetching them I also purchase the oil and LocTite for the bottom bolt. After that I'll see how much torque I can apply to the bolt.
BTW I'm still waiting for Megazip to answer my question about the tool.
I made a tool up to do my seals etc and when I went to undo the Allan bolts they just came out, didn't need the tool. :rolleyes:
I got an answer from Megazip and they say that they can not find a part no. for the K5+ tool.
@Nic loosening the bolt without a holding tool is not usually a problem. Tightening to the correct 40 Nm torque is.
Tim, next week ill go to my suspension bloke, ask him how he does it. I do all my own maintenance except forks, just not interested. Take them to him, does whatever needed, doesnt charge a lot. Never had a problem.
@grog that's good to hear, will be interesting to get a pro's opinion.
Today I got everything I need to finish my fork overhaul. I also bought a torque wrench which allows me to adjust the torque starting from 20 Nm and gradually increase it up to 40 Nm, if my tool withstands it.
I installed one cartridge and the tool worked well. The bottom bolt could be tightened to 40 Nm. However, before installing the other cartridge I will still improve my tool by tightening the tolerance closer to 32 mm and replacing the wire with sheet metal band to make it stronger.
I have now improved my tool. It fits the cartridge head perfectly and easily withstands tightening to 40 Nm.
(https://gsx1400owners.org/forum/gallery/0/3374-170122222208.jpeg)
(https://gsx1400owners.org/forum/gallery/0/3374-170122222250.jpeg)
The reason why I could not test the tool before was that I had to wait for a replacement bolt for the one I spoiled when trying to open it with an impact driver.
Awesome looking bit of kit you've made there! Well done, I'm sure you could sell those if you made more . . .
Quote from: KiwiCol on Tuesday, 18 January 2022, 01:51 AM
Awesome looking bit of kit you've made there! Well done, I'm sure you could sell those if you made more . . .
Agreed! ;-)
A new & improved tool will never go astray :facepalm: