Ok so yesterday I went for a great ride up into the Adelaide hills. About 150km round trip. Not a thrash, just a gentle ride while I practice everything and get used to how it handles. Lots of twisties. [mmm twisties]. Bike was fine, changing up and down gears hundreds of times but on the way home in traffic I found I couldn't select first gear no matter how hard I tapped down on the gear shifter...cars at the lights were waiting for me to take off and I'm dancing on the gear lever. I eventually engaged neutral, let the clutch out then back in again and it clunked into first. It got worse as I got closer to home and in the end it refused (without engaging neutral).
Happy to receive all suggestions:
1) Clutch adjustment?
2) Wrong oil?
3) Gearbox?
Clues:
- The bike has been sitting for 5 years before I bought it.
- Oil was changed about 500km ago (new filter).
- Up until yesterday the 1st gear clunk was sizeable but I figured that was normal for a bike with an elephant motor.
- Had no problems selecting first (or any) gear until now.
- Only ridden 500km so far. Oil is bang on at the correct level.
Quotethe 1st gear clunk was sizeable but I figured that was normal for a bike with an elephant motor.
Pretty normal for one of these bikes at any rate, in my experience.
Not sure on your first gear issue - but the gearbox problems with 1400s are usually 2nd gear so at least you are different!
This thread indicates that a 1st gear whine is not at all unusual https://gsx1400owners.org/forum/index.php?topic=1215.0
but of course FAILURE is a whole other thing.
Quote from: VladTepes on Thursday, 17 September 2020, 02:38 PM
Quotethe 1st gear clunk was sizeable but I figured that was normal for a bike with an elephant motor.
Pretty normal for one of these bikes at any rate, in my experience.
Not sure on your first gear issue - but the gearbox problems with 1400s are usually 2nd gear so at least you are different!
This thread indicates that a 1st gear whine is not at all unusual https://gsx1400owners.org/forum/index.php?topic=1215.0
but of course FAILURE is a whole other thing.
Yeah, I read about the second gear issue so I always use the clutch to smoothly change gears. New mechanic says "might be oil" that one is full mineral with maybe a drop of synth so they can call it "semi-synthetic". Been looking in the manual to find if it says "always use full synthetic oil" but haven't found it yet. I don't mind dropping the oil again (after only 500kms) because I wanted to cycle a few sumps worth of oil anyway to freshen it up. Searched through the forum but can't find anyone mentioning that they can't select first. I'll keep trying to find an answer online but just thought I'd ask you guys too in case anyone has any theories or solutions or things I could try.
It's possible the linkage might have slipped & be out of adjustment. Check it's all tight n looks in the right place.
The oil is right, 10/40 semi syn. That stuff is expensive though (here anyway) & a lot of us south of the equator have found Gulf Western 3000 a damn good oil & made in Aussie, Grog put us onto that one.
It's possible somehow the shift mechanism inside is worn / bent (because of someone dancing on it :whistling:) but that'd have to ba a long shot.
I'd also check the clutch is working correctly & is pushing the rod into the casing to disengage the clutch. Maybe air in there or old fluid? Give it a bleed & clean up whilst you're in there & bung the busa seal on the slave at the same time, cheap & stops crap getting in there. 90% chance it's the clutch not releasing correctly IMO.
Quote from: KiwiCol on Thursday, 17 September 2020, 03:56 PM
It's possible the linkage might have slipped & be out of adjustment. Check it's all tight n looks in the right place.
The oil is right, 10/40 semi syn. That stuff is expensive though (here anyway) & a lot of us south of the equator have found Gulf Western 3000 a damn good oil & made in Aussie, Grog put us onto that one.
It's possible somehow the shift mechanism inside is worn / bent (because of someone dancing on it :whistling:) but that'd have to ba a long shot.
I'd also check the clutch is working correctly & is pushing the rod into the casing to disengage the clutch. Maybe air in there or old fluid? Give it a bleed & clean up whilst you're in there & bung the busa seal on the slave at the same time, cheap & stops crap getting in there. 90% chance it's the clutch not releasing correctly IMO.
Excellent, thanks. I'll check all that stuff. I wasn't slamming it down that hard really (I exaggerated a bit). Time to bleed and flush I think. Just bought
this (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bjXHUy6wojA) for $100 (retail over $240) from Gumtree. Time to flush and bleed everything I think. Will also check the manual on how to adjust the linkage but will have to look up the busa seal thing and how to check the clutch rod. Links and tips fully appreciated.
Here ya go
https://gsx1400owners.org/forum/index.php?topic=259.0
This saga of a bike must of been cheap I assume :whatever: :whatever: :whatever:
Quote from: GSXKING on Thursday, 17 September 2020, 05:16 PM
This saga of a bike must of been cheap I assume :whatever: :whatever: :whatever:
Yes, but not as cheap as the page 3 girl from Essex . . .
Quote from: KiwiCol on Thursday, 17 September 2020, 05:20 PM
Quote from: GSXKING on Thursday, 17 September 2020, 05:16 PM
This saga of a bike must of been cheap I assume :whatever: :whatever: :whatever:
Yes, but not as cheap as the page 3 girl from Essex . . .
Col there is a difference between "cheap" and EASY LMAO :stir: :stir: :stir:
yeah, about $1.50
as it`s been sitting so long it could have nasties on the surface of the clutch plates, when you are riding it next pull the clutch a little and accelerate to make it slip a few times, and blip and drop it into first while you are still moving until it frees up
Like Col says Grog put us onto Gulf Western Syn-X 3000. Have used some very expensive Motul 300V also tried Motul 5100..... don't bother.
Lots to clean, adjust and flush before you really need to worry.
Worth taking your front sprocket cover off and having a good clean in behind there.
Hope you get a result :onya:
Quote from: GSXKING on Thursday, 17 September 2020, 05:16 PM
This saga of a bike must of been cheap I assume :whatever: :whatever: :whatever:
2008
40,000km (sold to me as a 70k bike)
heavily corroded ally everything
Good mechanically but needs (needed) a light cosmetic resto. Mechanically seems fine, pulls like a planet.
$4k plus transport = $4,500 in my driveway
Sounds hydraulic to me.
Strip & clean the slave clyinder & then bleed it up with fresh fluid. The heat of the engine kills clutch fluid even when they've not been stood for yonks.
Quote from: Irish in Oz on Thursday, 17 September 2020, 06:40 PM
Sounds hydraulic to me.
Quote from: Hooli on Thursday, 17 September 2020, 07:01 PM
Strip & clean the slave clyinder & then bleed it up with fresh fluid. The heat of the engine kills clutch fluid even when they've not been stood for yonks.
Yes, I was just reading that busa oil seal thread and it was mentioned that even in the best conditions it should be flushed every year so that's my next job. Doesn't sound impossible, no special tools required except the milk crate for sitting on.
Thanks for y'all help.
The only difficult bit is getting the two screws out that hold the metal plate over the slave. They are often an utter sod if they've not been out for a while. As you say the rest is easy though.
Quote from: Hooli on Thursday, 17 September 2020, 09:27 PM
The only difficult bit is getting the two screws out that hold the metal plate over the slave. They are often an utter sod if they've not been out for a while. As you say the rest is easy though.
Will I need a hardened phillips head socket and impact driver ya reckon? Or just a light knock on it's head?
The latter.
Hopefully.
Quote from: SA14 on Friday, 18 September 2020, 11:58 AM
Quote from: Hooli on Thursday, 17 September 2020, 09:27 PM
The only difficult bit is getting the two screws out that hold the metal plate over the slave. They are often an utter sod if they've not been out for a while. As you say the rest is easy though.
Will I need a hardened phillips head socket and impact driver ya reckon? Or just a light knock on it's head?
Proper JIS screwdrivers do it ok. They are a slightly different shape to phillips which is why jap screw heads always get screwed up.
One whack with impact driver, another person holding on. Worked for me. My impact bits are JIS.
Quote from: grog on Friday, 18 September 2020, 07:29 PM
One whack with impact driver, another person holding on. Worked for me. My impact bits are JIS.
I don't know any other people. Just me and doggo.
Quote from: Hooli on Friday, 18 September 2020, 05:44 PM
Proper JIS screwdrivers do it ok. They are a slightly different shape to phillips which is why jap screw heads always get screwed up.
I've always wondered about that! My good ol' Stanley set seems to be too sharply pointed for many phillips head screws and bottom out in the pit of the screw before the faces can get a good grip (I'm making terms up as I go along but hopefully that makes sense). Is that the problem? If so I'm looking up and buying a good set of JIS philips head screwdrivers, drill drivers and impact driver heads post haste.
I think there are three types of cross-headed screw. Phillips, JIS & Pozidrive but that might be wrong.
I'm not sure of the differences but it'll be the angle of the pointy bit & the thickness of the cross section I'd expect.
i had to take the slave off and put in the vise and i had wood and rags to support as not to damage it to undo those screws they were tight about 6 months ago
Quote from: stick3 on Saturday, 19 September 2020, 06:59 AM
i had to take the slave off and put in the vise and i had wood and rags to support as not to damage it to undo those screws they were tight about 6 months ago
I had to do that with mine, but others I've just undone with a screwdriver & holding the slave carrier.
Bit of an update: Took her out for a test ride just now for an hour or so and before I even left I noticed that (yep) the idle was a tad high at about 1,250 which I'm hoping was the major cause of the problem. I dropped it back to a needle thickness over 1,000rpm after she'd warmed up and along with the new Gulf Western Syn-X 3000 oil it's changing just fine and dropping into first with a pleasing thunk as expected. Did lots of smile inducing blipping too. Funny side effect it sharpens the first driver's attention at the lights "come on mate, let's get a move on!"
Ate some rain on the way home for the first time in over 35 years. Wasn't much of a problem really. It's rain, it comes off as you're going along.
Rain is ok, just remember to spit out the bugs!
Sorry SA, i hate blipping at lights, just me. Usually reserved for Harley boys, showing off their non muffled air compressors.
I think the Hardley guys do it cause they think it's about to stall, what do they idle at? 500/600rpm? It's like they're about to die by the sound of them.
Id like a laser gun that pointed at Harlys, just makes them die. Just my thoughts, sorry if i offend anyone. I should be nicer, just ordered some engine brightener from their shop. Cant get S100.
Quote from: grog on Thursday, 24 September 2020, 06:01 PM
Sorry SA, i hate blipping at lights, just me. Usually reserved for Harley boys, showing off their non muffled air compressors.
No probs, driver was asleep or texting. Figured it was better than tooting but apart from that I sit idling quietly 99% of the time.
Quote from: grog on Thursday, 24 September 2020, 06:35 PM
Id like a laser gun that pointed at Harlys, just makes them die.
Sadly the sidewinder missile accessory option on the 1402 was not taken up by most. I'd love to have that option for the Hardley Movington posers.
As Fred Gassit used to say "gettouttamyway ya cahn"
"I don't give a sh1t about Politics, Golf, Game Shows, World Debt, Speed Limits, Soap Operas, Traffic Jams, Cricket, Gardening, Religion, Girlie Bands, Pension Plans, Stocks & Shares, Graham Norton, G.M. Food, After shave Lotion, Tennis, Diets, The Oscars, Boy Bands, Old Age, Housework, French Cheese, Parking Meters, Fatism, The Weather, Stress Councelling, Decorating, Volvo Drivers, Cars, Town Councils, Animal Rights, Acid Rain, Rambling, Home Improvements, Alarm locks, Celebrity Gossip, Cooking Programs, Chat Shows, Exams, What the Neighbours Think, Fashion, Farming Subsidies, Speeding, UFOs, Gatso's, Tommorow! and spelling.
I JUST WANT TO RIDE MY BIKE." Not sure but think Fred said that.
I like how I don't have a phone mount on my bike. During my first ride the phone actually went flat. It felt like the 80s again. It was cool.