Hi, someone has a timing retard eliminator assemble.
There are someone for sale in ebay, and they say and I quote:
"How the Smart Timing Retard Eliminator works
Suzuki has limited the torque available through gears 1 to 4 up to 50% throttle. They have done this by retarding the ignition timing to such an extent that the result is a lower performing engine. The S-TRE will eliminate this problem.
The S-TRE alters the signal sent from the GPS to the ECU in turn the ECU then sends out un-restricted signals to the engine resulting in a higher performing motorcycle (full details below).
Improves acceleration
Improves throttle response
Switches for neutral selection to maintain a smooth idle and the cold start fast idle feature
Direct plug and play - connects straight to the wiring loom, no cutting, splicing or adjustments...
Please note:
Factory fitted gear indicators will display '5' when in any gear whilst this product is installed.
Many aftermarket gear indicators will continue to function correctly however those that read the gear position sensor will display '5' when in any gear whilst this product is installed.
The Dynojet Power Commander V (5) and higher have a gear input option (allow for map adjustment based on gear and speed) this function is not possible whilst this product is installed.
This product is compatible with Dynojet Power Commanders however may require re-programming and can occasionally lower performance before re-programmed."
Thanks in advance :onya:
Got to say though paca that TRE's in general do not have a very good reputation on the 14, it has been known in the past for some to cause the wiring loom to melt/catch fire (I suspect some cheap ones), and general feedback is that it is debatable as to whether or not they do actually work. Many I suspect sit on shelves in workshops and garages gathering dust. Most instead fit a 4 degree ignition advancer which works across all 6 gears OR modify the standard back plate to give the same effect.
on eBay: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Suzuki-GSX1400-Ignition-Advancer-4-degree-advance-NEW-free-post-in-the-uk/292375121470?hash=item4412ea4e3e:m:mutFy5YKbLPNMvAsw24G7yA
Mod to the standard backplate: http://gsx1400owners.org/forum_test/index.php?topic=144.0
:onya:
I fitted the Gipro-ATRE with gear indicator on mine.
It worked fine until I stripped and rebuilt the bike earlier this year..When I refitted it I was constantly getting error codes coming up however much I checked the wiring and connectors..I removed it and no more E codes.
In the end I slotted the backplate and advanced the ignition timing that way.
my gipro works fine, love aving gear indicator. hope it keeps going. no advance needed top 2 gears, would worry me on long hot hauls.
My Gipro-ATRE works just fine - great knowing what gear I am in ( mostly saves me trying to change up into 7th !!! ) :smile2:
Quote from: grog on Wednesday, 20 December 2017, 08:35 PM
my gipro works fine, love aving gear indicator. hope it keeps going. no advance needed top 2 gears, would worry me on long hot hauls.
That would worry me too. Plenty people here have done the backplate mod. Maybe they like to share their experience about it here.
Quote from: Andre on Thursday, 21 December 2017, 03:23 AM
Quote from: grog on Wednesday, 20 December 2017, 08:35 PM
my gipro works fine, love aving gear indicator. hope it keeps going. no advance needed top 2 gears, would worry me on long hot hauls.
That would worry me too. Plenty people here have done the backplate mod. Maybe they like to share their experience about it here.
Can't see why it would worry you guys - doing the back plate mod is the same as fitting the 4 degree advancer (available on eBay). I ran the A-TRE originally on my GiPRO, the switched the A-TRE off (so just ran it as a gear change indicator) and fitted the 4 degree advancer (same as the backplate mod) and (IMO) it worked just as well, but across all 6 gears without any issues at all. Including doing over 1500 miles touring in one week with 10% ethanol fuel (horrible stuff, but was all that was available at the pumps)
A lot of owners have either done the backplate mode or fitted the 4 degree advancer - no issues reported at all that I have seen or heard of either on this forum or the previous one. Why do you think it would be an issue in gears 5 and 6?
ive had a 4° advancer fitted for over 40000 miles no problems no extra power just runs a bit smoother .
:cheers:
@gsxbarmy The concern is with the non-retarded gears at high load (large throttle opening). High load requires less advance of the ignition timing. If the ignition occurs too early, the ignited A:F mix pushes against the piston while it is still moving up possibly resulting in engine damage. If there is no pinging/knocking you are probably fine. If there is, take the advance 2° back.
Maybe those who have the ignition advanced by 4° don't open the throttle all the way :whistling: or, more likely, the 4° are well within a safe range.
Also ethanol would not be a problem in this but low octane would.
Advancing the ignition in the retarded gears only cancels out the retarded timing (to whatever degree). So why not do both, TRE (which makes the ecu think it is in 5th gear with no advanced timing) and ignition advancement (would prefer the backplate mod as it can be adjusted) as they are two different things?
@Andre ive had my blue and white 14 (it's also got yoshi cams and other mods giving around 135bhp depending on the dyno)off the clock loaded with luggage over on an autobahn the motor didn't miss a beat and sounded just fine (the handling was another matter completely 3 lanes to keep it straight and on the road ) it's also been flat out several times on dynos again not a hint of rough running or pinking at all.
:cheers:
Thank you Seth, that eases my mind :) Problems would show up on the dyno. I'll get myself a round file and a seal for the engine side cover soon.
Full bore autobahn is also a good test for this as well as for tires, suspension, and neck muscles. Btw, the handling at high speed autobahn is one of the main (sensible) reasons why tires in Germany have to be approved for each bike model.
indeed it does the main problem was lots of luggage and suspension built to a cost .
its better since i upgraded both front and back tho the front is getting a major upgrade this winter .
its not a bike ment to handle at those speeds the frame isn't upto it .
i use the power of the bike for overtaking and mid range cruising rather than flat out .
but you have to give it a flat out blast every once in a while .
seth
My first 14 did very well at high speed autobahn, which I did lots of. Never questioned the suspension or anything else. My second was a different story. After 44k front and rear suspension were worn. Even with better tires it was suizide to take her to the limit. Rebuild of the rear and changing fork oil put an end to that. Front needs to be rebuild though. I'll do that before the season starts. My suspension specialist says to rebuild after 25 -30k on street use. Fork oil every 2 years.
Of cause you got 30 horses more. Might well be that the frame is not made for your top speed.
Quote from: Andre on Thursday, 21 December 2017, 06:44 AM
@gsxbarmy
The concern is with the non-retarded gears at high load (large throttle opening). High load requires less advance of the ignition timing. If the ignition occurs too early, the ignited A:F mix pushes against the piston while it is still moving up possibly resulting in engine damage. If there is no pinging/knocking you are probably fine. If there is, take the advance 2° back.
Maybe those who have the ignition advanced by 4° don't open the throttle all the way :whistling: or, more likely, the 4° are well within a safe range.
Also ethanol would not be a problem in this but low octane would.
Advancing the ignition in the retarded gears only cancels out the retarded timing (to whatever degree). So why not do both, TRE (which makes the ecu think it is in 5th gear with no advanced timing) and ignition advancement (would prefer the backplate mod as it can be adjusted) as they are two different things?
I made a back plate mod to my standard 14 ( K&N with opened intake and opened exhaust cans and some "fine" tunings with yoshi box).
I tested several ignition timings fom 0 to 5 degrees. The best result in my bike was 2 degrees (now with turbo it is a bit different thing).
@T 24Quote from: T 24 on Thursday, 21 December 2017, 01:31 PM
I made a back plate mod to my standard 14 ( K&N with opened intake and opened exhaust cans and some "fine" tunings with yoshi box).
I tested several ignition timings fom 0 to 5 degrees. The best result in my bike was 2 degrees (now with turbo it is a bit different thing).
That is interesting. I read a couple places where 2° were advised for non-tuned and lightly tuned 14s.
I think I remember your opened intake mod. Opening up the inlet of the K&N filter right?
Did you have open down pipes as well or just the cans?
Some say you can't tune fine enough with the yoshi box, while others say it is plenty for open exhaust. What is your take?
Quote from: Andre on Thursday, 21 December 2017, 04:56 PM
@T 24
Quote from: T 24 on Thursday, 21 December 2017, 01:31 PM
I made a back plate mod to my standard 14 ( K&N with opened intake and opened exhaust cans and some "fine" tunings with yoshi box).
I tested several ignition timings fom 0 to 5 degrees. The best result in my bike was 2 degrees (now with turbo it is a bit different thing).
That is interesting. I read a couple places where 2° were advised for non-tuned and lightly tuned 14s.
I think I remember your opened intake mod. Opening up the inlet of the K&N filter right?
Did you have open down pipes as well or just the cans?
Some say you can't tune fine enough with the yoshi box, while others say it is plenty for open exhaust. What is your take?
It was lightly tuned 14, but i was starting to do mods for turbo. So the cans were opened for turbo set up, and the downpipes were std.
And intake of K&N filter was opened to 54mm(?) and rounded, (there was a small difference at higher revs.)
"fine" tuning with Yoshi is like adjusting carbs with hammer. Now it is more useful,when I can also adjust secondary ecu/ injectors and fuel pressure.
I dont have or need PC 3 / 5. Ignition timing is std at the moment.